Discussion:
What do non-techies like the most about Ubuntu?
(too old to reply)
Chris Rowson
2007-05-15 20:57:15 UTC
Permalink
I thought it'd be interesting to find out what it is that impresses
new non-techie users the most about Ubuntu.

For people who are 'into' IT it may be engineering, adaptability or
the politics of FOSS. For the large majority though it's likely to be
something quite different.

I hope that this information will help us sell Ubuntu more effectively
and help focus in on some themes that can be included in future
marketing campaigns (like the leaflet suggestion for instance).

Here's my example.

Like many IT folks, I'm the unpaid tech support to an array of family
and friends. Anyone who comes to me wanting a basic desktop (ie - who
doesn't want to play computer games) gets Ubuntu.

What has surprised me is that the most commented on feature of Ubuntu
from the perspective of the non-technical user is the add/remove
programs menu option. People seem to be very impressed that they can
simply click a button and quality software appears for free, ready to
use on their computer.

Surely more can be made of this to punt the feature to new potential users....

Any other examples ?

Chris
Matthew Macdonald-Wallace
2007-05-16 05:08:55 UTC
Permalink
Post by Chris Rowson
I thought it'd be interesting to find out what it is that impresses
new non-techie users the most about Ubuntu.
I work on a helpdesk as a day job supporting windows 2K/XP and an
AS/400. Most of our users know how to use a computer to get their job
done and that's it. Any errors at all (from "my computer won't switch
on" to "the internet's gone down!!!!") are reported to us and we
basically tell them (after three, 1...2...3) "Have you tried switching
it off and back on again?" which, as it's windows, usually fixes the
problem.

One of our users who I can only describe as completely non technical
(she keeps doing house keeping on her "My Documents" folder and then
wondering why she can't locate files in the same place they were
before!) picked up a recycled PC from us the other day without an
operating system as we don't have licenses for that kit any more.

Quick as a flash, as soon as she had left the room I sent her an email
telling her about Ubuntu. I sourced a copy of Feisty for her and she
installed it without any issues, including the Internet Setup. She
then passed this PC to a charity who are using it for their daily work
without an issue.

So, to answer the question, the non-techies that I've spoken to like
Ubuntu for ease of use, quick installs and the fact that thinks "just
work".

Cheers,

M.
--
Matthew Macdonald-Wallace
Group Co-Ordinator
Thanet Linux User Group
http://www.thanet.lug.org.uk/
matthew at truthisfreedom.org.uk
GPG KEY: http://pgp.mit.edu:11371/pks/lookup?op=get&search=0xFEA1BC16
Alan Pope
2007-05-16 06:03:20 UTC
Permalink
Hi Matthew,
Post by Matthew Macdonald-Wallace
I work on a helpdesk as a day job supporting windows 2K/XP and an
AS/400. Most of our users know how to use a computer to get their job
done and that's it. Any errors at all (from "my computer won't switch
on" to "the internet's gone down!!!!") are reported to us and we
basically tell them (after three, 1...2...3) "Have you tried switching
it off and back on again?" which, as it's windows, usually fixes the
problem.
Arrrgh! No it doesn't!

For many issues it makes the problem (and hence the user) go away. It's a
quick bodge to make the user stop calling. It is the typical helpdesk
response in pretty much every company I have been in for the last 15 years.

Nobody bothers to analyse a problem to figure out what the underlying issue
is anymore. If it takes more than 30-60 mins to "resolve" a problem most
companies just re-image (format and reinstall from a known good image) the
hard disk and forget it.

I have been at companies where (on numerous occasions) the helpdesk have
offered exactly three options:-

1) Leave the problem as it is and live with it
2) Reboot
3) Re-image the PC

(note none of these is a "fix", all three are workarounds)

I have then investigated the problem for anything up to 10 to 20 minutes
(most often using a combination of google and the microsoft support website)
to discover a real fix - be it a hotfix, registery hack or whatever. Of
course if the helpdesk did that they would then have a nice knowledge base
of information to call upon to fix problems in the future.

Part of the reason for this may be that many companies employ low-skill 1st
line support operatives who have little actual technical or problem
diagnosis skills. They follow a roadmap which ultimately ends at the same
place "reboot or rebuild" when all other avenues are not applicable. Maybe
this is a good reason why Microsoft claim a low TCO of windows over Linux,
because when it does go wrong all you need is an index finger to push the
power button, not a few brain cells, some logic and reasoning.

I am not having a go at you or helpdesk people in general. I totally
understand that with a large number of users and a small helpdesk there is
little time to diagnose every problem. It can also be difficult to
diagnose problems on Windows machines - no easy ssh access, most activity
isn't logged etc. It is the attitide that rebooting "fixed" something that
gets my goat.

Bah! :)

</rant>

Cheers,
Al.
Matthew Macdonald-Wallace
2007-05-16 06:26:14 UTC
Permalink
Al,

I realise that this isn't personal, so I'll jump in with my thoughts
again... ;)
Post by Alan Pope
Hi Matthew,
Post by Matthew Macdonald-Wallace
I work on a helpdesk as a day job supporting windows 2K/XP and an
AS/400. Most of our users know how to use a computer to get their job
done and that's it. Any errors at all (from "my computer won't switch
on" to "the internet's gone down!!!!") are reported to us and we
basically tell them (after three, 1...2...3) "Have you tried switching
it off and back on again?" which, as it's windows, usually fixes the
problem.
Arrrgh! No it doesn't!
For many issues it makes the problem (and hence the user) go away. It's a
quick bodge to make the user stop calling. It is the typical helpdesk
response in pretty much every company I have been in for the last 15 years.
Nobody bothers to analyse a problem to figure out what the underlying issue
is anymore. If it takes more than 30-60 mins to "resolve" a problem most
companies just re-image (format and reinstall from a known good image) the
hard disk and forget it.
I have written scripts (in vbscript - eurrgh!) to remotely change
aspects of the registry based on google searches and the MSDN/TechNet
knowledge bases, I've had heated discussions with people who are in
higher positions within the team than me about how to fix certain
problems and the fact that we need to have test rigs to confirm the
fixes before rolling them out company wide, however frequently when I
produce a fix, I'm told that I'm not allowed to deploy it because it
hasn't been tested.

Without permission to deploy the fix, that leaves us with the three
options you gave (plus one more):

1) Leave the problem as it is and live with it
2) Reboot
3) Re-image the PC
4) Clear your temporary internet files

Whilst I agree that frequently a number of helpdesks do not employ
highly trained staff - or indeed provide the training required to
improve or retain staff - quite often the fixes provided by MS or
Google simply do not work. An example of this is the current issue I
and about 20,000 other across the globe have encountered with SVCHost
causing the CPU to run at 100%. I have tried every registry hack and
hotfix I can find. I have rebuilt my machine twice and rebooted it
several times - it turns out that this is an issue with Microsoft
Update/Office 2003 and that it should be fixed by a patch issued by
MS. I have installed that patch and I still encounter the same
issues. I have fed back to Microsoft about this and it still has not
been fixed.

By contrast, in Edgy I was frequently receiving an error with
Gnome-Settings-Demon failing to start and hogging my CPU on startup.
I found on the Ubuntu forums the fix: apt-get update/upgrade and it
started working immediately.

To summarise (because I didn't realise just how much I'd been
rambling...), yes, a lot of helpdesks use workarounds instead of
fixes, however quite often this is to do with politics and a lack of
leadership/training as opposed to a lack of knowledge. Also, the fact
that sometimes (and frequently I'm finding) the patch released by the
manufacturer either completely fails to work or creates another problem.

Cheers,

Matt
--
Matthew Macdonald-Wallace
Group Co-Ordinator
Thanet Linux User Group
http://www.thanet.lug.org.uk/
matthew at truthisfreedom.org.uk
GPG KEY: http://pgp.mit.edu:11371/pks/lookup?op=get&search=0xFEA1BC16
Alan Pope
2007-05-16 06:40:45 UTC
Permalink
Hi Matthew,
Post by Matthew Macdonald-Wallace
I realise that this isn't personal, so I'll jump in with my thoughts
again... ;)
Phew. I realised that someone could take my last mail badly if they read it
before having their first food/coffee/cigarette/brandy of the day. :)
Post by Matthew Macdonald-Wallace
produce a fix, I'm told that I'm not allowed to deploy it because it
hasn't been tested.
Good point. I wonder if those in power would have the same attitude if it
were *their* PC that was exhibiting the problem ;)
Post by Matthew Macdonald-Wallace
4) Clear your temporary internet files
Oooh, good one, I'd forgotten that chestnut!
Post by Matthew Macdonald-Wallace
Google simply do not work. An example of this is the current issue I
and about 20,000 other across the globe have encountered with SVCHost
causing the CPU to run at 100%.
o/ Me included. One of my customers provides me with a Windows laptop to
remotely administer their system. I booted up on Monday after a week away
from work and did exactly what you said. I walked away and it was fine a
couple of hours later after the updates had applied and it had rebooted
itself.
Post by Matthew Macdonald-Wallace
By contrast, in Edgy I was frequently receiving an error with
Gnome-Settings-Demon failing to start and hogging my CPU on startup.
I found on the Ubuntu forums the fix: apt-get update/upgrade and it
started working immediately.
Of course Linux isn't perfect, there are times Linux and Ubuntu apps break
and there may be some difficulty getting them fixed. One big difference (to
get back on topic ;) ) between Linux and Windows I find is accessibility of
the developers.

I can go online and via irc can contact one of a number of developers
personally (if they don't mind), if I report bugs or contact a mailing list
often the developers themselves respond. I contrast this with the Windows
world where I find many armchair experts voicing their opinion of problems,
but I rarely stumble upon a developer.

Last week I attended UDS which was (as the name suggests - Ubuntu Developer
Summit) a developer overload. Over a hundred Ubuntu (and upstream)
developers in one place! There were a few occasions where I asked someone
"who'd be the best person to help me with XYZ?". I got passed to a couple of
people and very quickly (like within a minute or two) I was sat down talking
to someone who could really help me. Does that exist in the Windows world?

Cheers,
Al.
Matthew Macdonald-Wallace
2007-05-16 07:05:00 UTC
Permalink
Post by Alan Pope
Hi Matthew,
Post by Matthew Macdonald-Wallace
I realise that this isn't personal, so I'll jump in with my thoughts
again... ;)
Phew. I realised that someone could take my last mail badly if they read it
before having their first food/coffee/cigarette/brandy of the day. :)
LOL, Unfortunately the canteen doesn't open for a grease-fest until
9:30 here - and I've been on shift since 6!
Post by Alan Pope
Post by Matthew Macdonald-Wallace
produce a fix, I'm told that I'm not allowed to deploy it because it
hasn't been tested.
Good point. I wonder if those in power would have the same attitude if it
were *their* PC that was exhibiting the problem ;)
Obviously, No. :o) I was told the other day "If any computer comes in
with non company-standard software, especially iTunes or any other
'file sharing and downloading' software, it is to be removed. No
exceptions." I asked if this applied to the I.T Director and the head
of Finance and was effectively (but politely) told that if I removed
any "non-standard" software from either of those machines I would
probably collect my P45 the next day.
Post by Alan Pope
Post by Matthew Macdonald-Wallace
4) Clear your temporary internet files
Oooh, good one, I'd forgotten that chestnut!
Post by Matthew Macdonald-Wallace
Google simply do not work. An example of this is the current issue I
and about 20,000 other across the globe have encountered with SVCHost
causing the CPU to run at 100%.
o/ Me included. One of my customers provides me with a Windows laptop to
remotely administer their system. I booted up on Monday after a week away
from work and did exactly what you said. I walked away and it was fine a
couple of hours later after the updates had applied and it had rebooted
itself.
Where did you find that patch? I need it!!! :)
Post by Alan Pope
Post by Matthew Macdonald-Wallace
By contrast, in Edgy I was frequently receiving an error with
Gnome-Settings-Demon failing to start and hogging my CPU on startup.
I found on the Ubuntu forums the fix: apt-get update/upgrade and it
started working immediately.
Of course Linux isn't perfect, there are times Linux and Ubuntu apps break
and there may be some difficulty getting them fixed. One big difference (to
get back on topic ;) ) between Linux and Windows I find is accessibility of
the developers.
I can go online and via irc can contact one of a number of developers
personally (if they don't mind), if I report bugs or contact a mailing list
often the developers themselves respond. I contrast this with the Windows
world where I find many armchair experts voicing their opinion of problems,
but I rarely stumble upon a developer.
Agreed - and how frustrating is that?!
Post by Alan Pope
Last week I attended UDS which was (as the name suggests - Ubuntu Developer
Summit) a developer overload. Over a hundred Ubuntu (and upstream)
developers in one place! There were a few occasions where I asked someone
"who'd be the best person to help me with XYZ?". I got passed to a couple of
people and very quickly (like within a minute or two) I was sat down talking
to someone who could really help me. Does that exist in the Windows world?
Not that I know of, and I think that the time it takes to fix
something is often another issues that a lot of Users have with
Windows - why release all your fixes once a month, why not when
they're ready?

Anyway, enough ranting from me, I'd better do some work... :(

Cheers,

Matt (desperately trying to persuade his boss to let him install
Ubuntu at work...)
--
Matthew Macdonald-Wallace
Group Co-Ordinator
Thanet Linux User Group
http://www.thanet.lug.org.uk/
matthew at truthisfreedom.org.uk
GPG KEY: http://pgp.mit.edu:11371/pks/lookup?op=get&search=0xFEA1BC16
Chris Jones
2007-05-18 19:58:08 UTC
Permalink
Hi
Post by Matthew Macdonald-Wallace
Windows - why release all your fixes once a month, why not when
Mostly because of all the pain windows updates create. You wouldn't want
to be doing that every week! ;)

Cheers,
--
Chris Jones
cmsj at canonical.com
www.canonical.com
Robin Menneer
2007-05-19 08:52:48 UTC
Permalink
Post by Chris Jones
Hi
Post by Matthew Macdonald-Wallace
Windows - why release all your fixes once a month, why not when
Mostly because of all the pain windows updates create. You wouldn't want
to be doing that every week! ;)
Cheers,
--
Chris Jones
cmsj at canonical.com
www.canonical.com
I'm very happy to receive updates periodically - it means that someone
ouit there actually cares. But not regularly. Just according to need
please Robin
--
ubuntu-uk at lists.ubuntu.com
https://lists.ubuntu.com/mailman/listinfo/ubuntu-uk
https://wiki.kubuntu.org/UKTeam/
-------------- next part --------------
An HTML attachment was scrubbed...
URL: https://lists.ubuntu.com/archives/ubuntu-uk/attachments/20070519/c74f8106/attachment-0001.htm
Chris Jones
2007-05-18 19:56:36 UTC
Permalink
Hi
Post by Matthew Macdonald-Wallace
fixes before rolling them out company wide, however frequently when I
produce a fix, I'm told that I'm not allowed to deploy it because it
hasn't been tested.
Hacking at Windows that way massively increases the complexity of
support. If you find such a bug in Ubuntu you can file it on launchpad,
maybe track it down yourself and submit a patch, and stay in touch with
the whole thing, then deploy a new package when it's fixed (building
your own if necessary in the interim). Next time you dist-upgrade the
machine it will install a new version of the package and all will
continue as expected.

Going back to the Windows world, your registry fix is going to persist
indefinitely, even if it gets subsequently fixed by a Hotfix or a
Service Pack. That may have unexpected, unwanted or worse, undefined
consequences.

Even if you do track down the problem, you can't feed it back upstream
as easily, so why does it matter that you save time and money by quickly
re-imaging the PC?

You forgot:

0) Make use of your support contract for Windows. You do have a support
contract, right? ;)
Post by Matthew Macdonald-Wallace
1) Leave the problem as it is and live with it
Windows depends on being a known target, not a highly moving target, so
I would always advise against deviating from the expected footprint any
more than is necessary.

Cheers,
--
Chris Jones
cmsj at canonical.com
www.canonical.com
Nicholas Butler
2007-05-16 07:03:04 UTC
Permalink
I have managed to convince a number of Clients, Friends and Contacts who
are considered "Non-Techie" to do a Video Broadcast chat with me about
what they perceive as their needs and concerns are in relation to Open
source and computer usage. The first one occured last Monday and Suzy
Miller of Certainshops took time to highlight a few thoughts and
concerns about Ubuntu. She will be coming back in 8 weeks to talk about
her experiences in using Ubuntu and other Open Source applications to
run her business. As a non techie what she liked was the apparent lack
of "effort" required in getting things done. Not worrying about Virus
and Trojans and Malware just selfinstalling and ruining her day was a
big plus to her. She also liked the idea that the Hardrive could be
swapped around PCs without the whole Nagging reinstall driver issue
which deters many Windows support people. I know DaveMorris and Gazzak
watched the last show and unfortunately the recording failed to appear
at the other end however I am planning to do at least four talks and if
I can find more volunteers to join in then I will do more of them. Im
not sure if I have answered the question but I can confirm that for many
non techies Ubuntu 7.04 is the most ready they have been for the Linux
Desktop in a long time.

Nik
Matthew Macdonald-Wallace
2007-05-16 07:07:02 UTC
Permalink
Post by Nicholas Butler
I have managed to convince a number of Clients, Friends and Contacts who
are considered "Non-Techie" to do a Video Broadcast chat with me about
what they perceive as their needs and concerns are in relation to Open
source and computer usage.
Nik,

Is there any chance you could get permission for these to be used at
Software Freedom Day events?

A few short video clips about how Linux has helped small businesses
and non-technical people would be a real boost to anyone's "marketing"
arsenal...

Cheers,

M.
--
Matthew Macdonald-Wallace
Group Co-Ordinator
Thanet Linux User Group
http://www.thanet.lug.org.uk/
matthew at truthisfreedom.org.uk
GPG KEY: http://pgp.mit.edu:11371/pks/lookup?op=get&search=0xFEA1BC16
Nik Butler
2007-05-16 07:48:24 UTC
Permalink
I will ask , I really dont think it will be a problem though since all
my Clients like to use it as a platform to promote themselves so they
tend to approve of the concept of free advertising.


Nik
Robin Menneer
2007-05-16 09:35:58 UTC
Permalink
Post by Chris Rowson
I thought it'd be interesting to find out what it is that impresses
new non-techie users the most about Ubuntu.
For people who are 'into' IT it may be engineering, adaptability or
the politics of FOSS. For the large majority though it's likely to be
something quite different.
I hope that this information will help us sell Ubuntu more effectively
and help focus in on some themes that can be included in future
marketing campaigns (like the leaflet suggestion for instance).
Here's my example.
Like many IT folks, I'm the unpaid tech support to an array of family
and friends. Anyone who comes to me wanting a basic desktop (ie - who
doesn't want to play computer games) gets Ubuntu.
What has surprised me is that the most commented on feature of Ubuntu
from the perspective of the non-technical user is the add/remove
programs menu option. People seem to be very impressed that they can
simply click a button and quality software appears for free, ready to
use on their computer.
Surely more can be made of this to punt the feature to new potential users....
Any other examples ?
Chris
Like your people I was and am deeply impressed with the Add/Remove facility
(it keeps me away from the dreaded terminal) but it lacks depth. Alter
looking through the list of software and finding two or three that
attracted me, I couldn't easily find a definitive list of thickie
application programs on the web. they are scattered all over the place and
I had to use this list to find what I wanted. I had expected some sort of
link(s) attached somewhere in the add.remove sector which took me to a long
list of free applications which did something for me outside of just getting
the computer to work, A keyword search facility should be atttached.
I use Ububtu because it is reliable, free and friendly Robin.

--
Post by Chris Rowson
ubuntu-uk at lists.ubuntu.com
https://lists.ubuntu.com/mailman/listinfo/ubuntu-uk
https://wiki.kubuntu.org/UKTeam/
-------------- next part --------------
An HTML attachment was scrubbed...
URL: https://lists.ubuntu.com/archives/ubuntu-uk/attachments/20070516/550c1cda/attachment-0001.htm
David Morley
2007-05-16 10:47:25 UTC
Permalink
Depends business/self employed an accounts app.

Home users more of the same as newer better apps become available drop
them in. Brasero in main would be good. More stuff for rhythmbox and
better integration i.e. It's the main music player but totem plays a
track if you click on it (it's just wrong), a plugin for stream tuner
would be nice then no need for xmms to be installed.

On a usability issue making gnome-app-install the prominent installer
is genius but it either needs to ask people sensible questions like
"These packages are also available for this Application they just add
extra functions, Would you like to install them?". For extra package
examples currently are streamtuner requires xmms, checkgmail needs a
package libcrypt-simple-perl in order that your passward isn't human
readable, Wesnoth is now fixed with wesnoth-all but there are others
where although a package isn't required it is needed to complete the
app.


Other than that just more of the same quality we've come to expect.
--
Seek That Thy Might Know
christopher chatfield
2007-05-17 07:45:45 UTC
Permalink
Post by Chris Rowson
I thought it'd be interesting to find out what it is that impresses
new non-techie users the most about Ubuntu.
For people who are 'into' IT it may be engineering,
adaptability or
the politics of FOSS. For the large majority though it's likely to be
something quite different.
I hope that this information will help us sell Ubuntu more effectively
and help focus in on some themes that can be included in future
marketing campaigns (like the leaflet suggestion for
instance).
Here's my example.
Like many IT folks, I'm the unpaid tech support to an array of family
and friends. Anyone who comes to me wanting a basic desktop (ie - who
doesn't want to play computer games) gets Ubuntu.
What has surprised me is that the most commented on feature of Ubuntu
from the perspective of the non-technical user is the
add/remove
programs menu option. People seem to be very impressed that they can
simply click a button and quality software appears for free, ready to
use on their computer.
Surely more can be made of this to punt the feature to new
potential users....
Any other examples ?
Chris
Like your people I was and am deeply impressed with the Add/Remove
facility (it keeps me away from the dreaded terminal) but it lacks
depth. Alter looking through the list of software and finding two or
three that attracted me, I couldn't easily find a definitive list of
thickie application programs on the web. they are scattered all over
the place and I had to use this list to find what I wanted. I had
expected some sort of link(s) attached somewhere in the add.remove
sector which took me to a long list of free applications which did
something for me outside of just getting the computer to work, A
keyword search facility should be atttached.
I use Ububtu because it is reliable, free and friendly Robin.
BTW you could use synaptic, perhaps that's whats needed,
an even more graphical synaptic with a tree structure for
displaying related packages eg: Networking>Mail>Clients>Kmail.

hris
Post by Chris Rowson
--
ubuntu-uk at lists.ubuntu.com
https://lists.ubuntu.com/mailman/listinfo/ubuntu-uk
https://wiki.kubuntu.org/UKTeam/
Robin Menneer
2007-05-17 09:20:26 UTC
Permalink
Post by christopher chatfield
Post by Chris Rowson
I thought it'd be interesting to find out what it is that impresses
new non-techie users the most about Ubuntu.
For people who are 'into' IT it may be engineering,
adaptability or
the politics of FOSS. For the large majority though it's likely to be
something quite different.
I hope that this information will help us sell Ubuntu more effectively
and help focus in on some themes that can be included in future
marketing campaigns (like the leaflet suggestion for
instance).
Here's my example.
Like many IT folks, I'm the unpaid tech support to an array of family
and friends. Anyone who comes to me wanting a basic desktop (ie - who
doesn't want to play computer games) gets Ubuntu.
What has surprised me is that the most commented on feature of Ubuntu
from the perspective of the non-technical user is the add/remove
programs menu option. People seem to be very impressed that they can
simply click a button and quality software appears for free, ready to
use on their computer.
Surely more can be made of this to punt the feature to new
potential users....
Any other examples ?
Chris
Like your people I was and am deeply impressed with the Add/Remove
facility (it keeps me away from the dreaded terminal) but it lacks
depth. Alter looking through the list of software and finding two or
three that attracted me, I couldn't easily find a definitive list of
thickie application programs on the web. they are scattered all over
the place and I had to use this list to find what I wanted. I had
expected some sort of link(s) attached somewhere in the add.remove
sector which took me to a long list of free applications which did
something for me outside of just getting the computer to work, A
keyword search facility should be atttached.
I use Ububtu because it is reliable, free and friendly Robin.
BTW you could use synaptic, perhaps that's whats needed,
an even more graphical synaptic with a tree structure for
displaying related packages eg: Networking>Mail>Clients>Kmail.
hris
Post by Chris Rowson
--
ubuntu-uk at lists.ubuntu.com
https://lists.ubuntu.com/mailman/listinfo/ubuntu-uk
https://wiki.kubuntu.org/UKTeam/
Why should I have to use synaptic when the Add/Remove faciity aready
exists. This is what I mean about things getting complicated. Robin
--
ubuntu-uk at lists.ubuntu.com
https://lists.ubuntu.com/mailman/listinfo/ubuntu-uk
https://wiki.kubuntu.org/UKTeam/
-------------- next part --------------
An HTML attachment was scrubbed...
URL: https://lists.ubuntu.com/archives/ubuntu-uk/attachments/20070517/5ee11cb5/attachment-0001.htm
London School of Puppetry
2007-05-20 11:30:20 UTC
Permalink
Post by christopher chatfield
Post by Chris Rowson
I thought it'd be interesting to find out what it is that impresses
new non-techie users the most about Ubuntu.
For people who are 'into' IT it may be engineering,
adaptability or
the politics of FOSS. For the large majority though it's likely to be
something quite different.
I hope that this information will help us sell Ubuntu more effectively
and help focus in on some themes that can be included in future
marketing campaigns (like the leaflet suggestion for
instance).
Here's my example.
Like many IT folks, I'm the unpaid tech support to an array of family
and friends. Anyone who comes to me wanting a basic desktop (ie - who
doesn't want to play computer games) gets Ubuntu.
What has surprised me is that the most commented on feature of Ubuntu
from the perspective of the non-technical user is the add/remove
programs menu option. People seem to be very impressed that they can
simply click a button and quality software appears for free, ready to
use on their computer.
Surely more can be made of this to punt the feature to new
potential users....
Any other examples ?
Chris
Like your people I was and am deeply impressed with the Add/Remove
facility (it keeps me away from the dreaded terminal) but it lacks
depth. Alter looking through the list of software and finding two or
three that attracted me, I couldn't easily find a definitive list of
thickie application programs on the web. they are scattered all over
the place and I had to use this list to find what I wanted. I had
expected some sort of link(s) attached somewhere in the add.remove
sector which took me to a long list of free applications which did
something for me outside of just getting the computer to work, A
keyword search facility should be atttached.
I use Ububtu because it is reliable, free and friendly Robin.
BTW you could use synaptic, perhaps that's whats needed,
an even more graphical synaptic with a tree structure for
displaying related packages eg: Networking>Mail>Clients>Kmail.
hris
Hi There- It is the politics of Linux etc that attracted me. But I also find
it easy to use and I like the way updates are continually happening. I now
have Feisty on my laptop too. I am always recommending it to friends but
they always look so alarmed at the thought of change and I 'm not very good
at telling them why Ubuntu is so much better.- someone give me some sales
talk quick!!!

Caroline (LSP)
Post by christopher chatfield
Post by Chris Rowson
--
ubuntu-uk at lists.ubuntu.com
https://lists.ubuntu.com/mailman/listinfo/ubuntu-uk
https://wiki.kubuntu.org/UKTeam/
--
ubuntu-uk at lists.ubuntu.com
https://lists.ubuntu.com/mailman/listinfo/ubuntu-uk
https://wiki.kubuntu.org/UKTeam/
--
---
London School of Puppetry
www.londonschoolofpuppetry.com
-------------- next part --------------
An HTML attachment was scrubbed...
URL: https://lists.ubuntu.com/archives/ubuntu-uk/attachments/20070520/44cd9119/attachment.htm
Gregory Kirby
2007-05-20 12:07:46 UTC
Permalink
Post by London School of Puppetry
Hi There- It is the politics of Linux etc that attracted me. But I also
find it easy to use and I like the way updates are continually
happening.? I now have Feisty on my laptop too.? I am always
recommending? it to friends but they always look so alarmed at the
thought of change and I 'm not very good at telling them why Ubuntu is
so much better.- someone give me some sales talk quick!!!
Caroline (LSP)
My penny's worth...

1. Free of tedious and expensive licensing
2. Gives you back some control of your computer leading to better
understanding of what you can achieve with it.
3. Friendliest support ever seen in IT!

Gregory
christopher chatfield
2007-05-21 07:27:32 UTC
Permalink
It's affordable, no marketing stealing your housekeeping expenses.
The shear delight of finding you can do what you want to do in 2 mins
without spending another penny!
Post by Gregory Kirby
Post by London School of Puppetry
Hi There- It is the politics of Linux etc that attracted me. But I also
find it easy to use and I like the way updates are continually
happening. I now have Feisty on my laptop too. I am always
recommending it to friends but they always look so alarmed at the
thought of change and I 'm not very good at telling them why Ubuntu is
so much better.- someone give me some sales talk quick!!!
Caroline (LSP)
My penny's worth...
1. Free of tedious and expensive licensing
2. Gives you back some control of your computer leading to better
understanding of what you can achieve with it.
3. Friendliest support ever seen in IT!
Gregory
Chris Rowson
2007-05-20 18:48:11 UTC
Permalink
I am always recommending it to friends but
Post by London School of Puppetry
they always look so alarmed at the thought of change and I 'm not very good
at telling them why Ubuntu is so much better.- someone give me some sales
talk quick!!!
Caroline (LSP)
Hi Caroline, Giving someone a good reason to change, when they're
happy with what they have is always hard !

I think its important to draw their attention to the negative aspects
of Windows. and contrasting them against the positive attributes of
Linux may work. Most people have never used anything other than
Windows. They assume that all computers are slow, need lots of
resources and get virus's (or is it viri!). Show them that there is a
choice... Like the bank advert says "There is another way.."

For instance:

Q: Have you ever had a virus?

Did you know that some virus's/malware can steal your personal
details, turn your Windows computer into a gateway for pornographic
emails and get you into trouble? Ubuntu by the way isn't susceptible
to virus's like Windows is. Using Ubuntu can safeguard you from bad
people on the internet.

Q: Does your computer start up slowly? If not, you're guaranteed that
it will after time..

Did you know that Windows gets more and more 'bloated' the longer you
use it? This slows your Windows computer down, making it unresponsive
and sluggish. Ubuntu is designed differently. It doesn't get fat like
Windows ;-)

Q: Does it cost you a lot of money, every time you need a new program
to do something?

A standard version of Microsoft Office 2007 could cost you around 300
quid, Photoshop could cost you more. Did you know that Ubuntu has
thousands of programs available for free at the click of a button, and
you can still open all of your old Microsoft Office documents too!

In fact, this sounds like a reasonably good way to market Ubuntu via
leaflets etc!

Chris
Robin Menneer
2007-05-20 20:37:13 UTC
Permalink
Post by London School of Puppetry
I am always recommending it to friends but
Post by London School of Puppetry
they always look so alarmed at the thought of change and I 'm not very
good
Post by London School of Puppetry
at telling them why Ubuntu is so much better.- someone give me some
sales
Post by London School of Puppetry
talk quick!!!
Caroline (LSP)
Hi Caroline, Giving someone a good reason to change, when they're
happy with what they have is always hard !
I think its important to draw their attention to the negative aspects
of Windows. and contrasting them against the positive attributes of
Linux may work. Most people have never used anything other than
Windows. They assume that all computers are slow, need lots of
resources and get virus's (or is it viri!). Show them that there is a
choice... Like the bank advert says "There is another way.."
Q: Have you ever had a virus?
Did you know that some virus's/malware can steal your personal
details, turn your Windows computer into a gateway for pornographic
emails and get you into trouble? Ubuntu by the way isn't susceptible
to virus's like Windows is. Using Ubuntu can safeguard you from bad
people on the internet.
Q: Does your computer start up slowly? If not, you're guaranteed that
it will after time..
Did you know that Windows gets more and more 'bloated' the longer you
use it? This slows your Windows computer down, making it unresponsive
and sluggish. Ubuntu is designed differently. It doesn't get fat like
Windows ;-)
Q: Does it cost you a lot of money, every time you need a new program
to do something?
A standard version of Microsoft Office 2007 could cost you around 300
quid, Photoshop could cost you more. Did you know that Ubuntu has
thousands of programs available for free at the click of a button, and
you can still open all of your old Microsoft Office documents too!
In fact, this sounds like a reasonably good way to market Ubuntu via
leaflets etc!
Chris
-
Ububtu is reliable, free and friendly - Windows isn't any of these.

-
Post by London School of Puppetry
ubuntu-uk at lists.ubuntu.com
https://lists.ubuntu.com/mailman/listinfo/ubuntu-uk
https://wiki.kubuntu.org/UKTeam/
-------------- next part --------------
An HTML attachment was scrubbed...
URL: https://lists.ubuntu.com/archives/ubuntu-uk/attachments/20070520/4bb6c939/attachment.htm
London School of Puppetry
2007-05-20 23:45:31 UTC
Permalink
Post by Robin Menneer
Post by London School of Puppetry
I am always recommending it to friends but
Post by London School of Puppetry
they always look so alarmed at the thought of change and I 'm not very
good
Post by London School of Puppetry
at telling them why Ubuntu is so much better.- someone give me some
sales
Post by London School of Puppetry
talk quick!!!
Caroline (LSP)
Hi Caroline, Giving someone a good reason to change, when they're
happy with what they have is always hard !
I think its important to draw their attention to the negative aspects
of Windows. and contrasting them against the positive attributes of
Linux may work. Most people have never used anything other than
Windows. They assume that all computers are slow, need lots of
resources and get virus's (or is it viri!). Show them that there is a
choice... Like the bank advert says "There is another way.."
Q: Have you ever had a virus?
Did you know that some virus's/malware can steal your personal
details, turn your Windows computer into a gateway for pornographic
emails and get you into trouble? Ubuntu by the way isn't susceptible
to virus's like Windows is. Using Ubuntu can safeguard you from bad
people on the internet.
Q: Does your computer start up slowly? If not, you're guaranteed that
it will after time..
Did you know that Windows gets more and more 'bloated' the longer you
use it? This slows your Windows computer down, making it unresponsive
and sluggish. Ubuntu is designed differently. It doesn't get fat like
Windows ;-)
Q: Does it cost you a lot of money, every time you need a new program
to do something?
A standard version of Microsoft Office 2007 could cost you around 300
quid, Photoshop could cost you more. Did you know that Ubuntu has
thousands of programs available for free at the click of a button, and
you can still open all of your old Microsoft Office documents too!
In fact, this sounds like a reasonably good way to market Ubuntu via
leaflets etc!
Chris
-
Ububtu is reliable, free and friendly - Windows isn't any of these.
Hello Robin- thanks.

-
Post by Robin Menneer
Post by London School of Puppetry
ubuntu-uk at lists.ubuntu.com
https://lists.ubuntu.com/mailman/listinfo/ubuntu-uk
https://wiki.kubuntu.org/UKTeam/
--
ubuntu-uk at lists.ubuntu.com
https://lists.ubuntu.com/mailman/listinfo/ubuntu-uk
https://wiki.kubuntu.org/UKTeam/
--
---
London School of Puppetry
www.londonschoolofpuppetry.com
-------------- next part --------------
An HTML attachment was scrubbed...
URL: https://lists.ubuntu.com/archives/ubuntu-uk/attachments/20070521/3725d61f/attachment.htm
norman
2007-05-21 08:00:08 UTC
Permalink
< big snip >
Post by Robin Menneer
Ububtu is reliable, free and friendly - Windows isn't any of these.
I have followed this discussion and others for some time now and would
like to tell you of my recent experience. I have used Ubuntu on my
desktop since September 2004 and have moved along through all its
varieties. I am not a techie but believe that I have a vague
understanding of some of the uses for Ubuntu and support its philosophy.
In my household there are 3 computers, a scanner and a printer linked
via a wireless network. The machines are used for work related
activities as well as for interest and pleasure. That is the scene.

On Friday of last week I updated from 6.10 to 7.04, which was an easy
and not too time consuming a process. Horror upon horrors, the scanner
does not work any more and the machines no longer link to the printer.
Now tell me, what am I to do? Here am I, in all good faith upgrading my
system and find I have taken several steps backwards. What has happened
to my confidence in a reliable and friendly system? So beware in
spreading the gospel of Linux and be aware of some of the pitfalls
awaiting.

One further point. I like reading items on usenet for which I have
always used Pan. My old Pan does not work anymore. A new version of Pan
has taken its place which expects me to set up from scratch and makes no
attempt to recover all the information and settings that I had on
previous versions of Ubuntu. Windows might do this sort of thing but
Ubuntu, never.

Enough, say no more.

Norman
Alan Pope
2007-05-21 09:39:06 UTC
Permalink
Post by norman
and not too time consuming a process. Horror upon horrors, the scanner
does not work any more and the machines no longer link to the printer.
Now tell me, what am I to do?
Visit this site and create one support ticket for each problem you have. One
for the printer, one for the scanner and one for pan.

Detail the make and model of the printer/scanner and what you used to do
that made it work and how it now doesn't work. Detail any error messages you
receive.

http://answers.launchpad.net/ubuntu/ - If you are not already registered,
then click the link at the top right to register. Once registered come back
to that page and click "Ask a question" in the top left.

Cheers,
Al.
norman
2007-05-21 10:16:51 UTC
Permalink
Post by Alan Pope
Post by norman
and not too time consuming a process. Horror upon horrors, the scanner
does not work any more and the machines no longer link to the printer.
Now tell me, what am I to do?
Visit this site and create one support ticket for each problem you have. One
for the printer, one for the scanner and one for pan.
Detail the make and model of the printer/scanner and what you used to do
that made it work and how it now doesn't work. Detail any error messages you
receive.
http://answers.launchpad.net/ubuntu/ - If you are not already registered,
then click the link at the top right to register. Once registered come back
to that page and click "Ask a question" in the top left.
I am quite happy to do this if you can give a really good reason why I
should. Perhaps I should have added to the first paragraph in my
original post that I have been reporting bugs and making, what I hope
were useful comments, for more 2 1/2 years. I am not one to name drop
but, if you want a little more background, I suggest you look up Daniel
Silverstone who is my son.

The problem with the scanner has been reported time and time again by
many users of different scanners. I believe the bug was known to the
developers even before 7.04 was released. I have been lead to understand
that the scanner problem may not be resolved before the next Ubuntu
release. If true this is not good enough and leaves a very bad taste.
The use of the scanner is for work not an intellectual exercise.

The printer problem is well known internationally and has occurred
before when changing from one Ubuntu to another. This was solved in the
past, the 'how to' publicised but has happened yet again. So much for
reports being noted.

As for Pan, this has been well discussed and details have already been
publicised. If you want more detail have a look at ubuntu-users list.

Norman
Alan Pope
2007-05-21 12:02:46 UTC
Permalink
Hi Norman,
Post by norman
Post by Alan Pope
Post by norman
and not too time consuming a process. Horror upon horrors, the scanner
does not work any more and the machines no longer link to the printer.
Now tell me, what am I to do?
Visit this site and create one support ticket for each problem you have. One
for the printer, one for the scanner and one for pan.
Detail the make and model of the printer/scanner and what you used to do
that made it work and how it now doesn't work. Detail any error messages you
receive.
http://answers.launchpad.net/ubuntu/ - If you are not already registered,
then click the link at the top right to register. Once registered come back
to that page and click "Ask a question" in the top left.
I am quite happy to do this if you can give a really good reason why I
should.
You sent a mail to a loco team list complaining that 3 things we broken with
your upgrade. Your mail was sent in reply to another mail, mid way through a
thread.

The visibility by skilled people who can help you solve this issue is
therefore minimal. So the chances that someone might respond will be low.
However now we are talking about it I am sure someone will reply.

The answer tracker I pointed you to is a support system on Launchpad. It is
part of the Ubuntu infrastructure. There are a number of people who
subscribe to the answer tracker and receive all the support requests that
come in. They spend their time answering exactly the kinds of questions you
posed.
Post by norman
Perhaps I should have added to the first paragraph in my
original post that I have been reporting bugs and making, what I hope
were useful comments, for more 2 1/2 years. I am not one to name drop
but, if you want a little more background, I suggest you look up Daniel
Silverstone who is my son.
I am not entirely sure what relavence that has to the issues you are having.
Post by norman
The problem with the scanner has been reported time and time again by
many users of different scanners. I believe the bug was known to the
developers even before 7.04 was released. I have been lead to understand
that the scanner problem may not be resolved before the next Ubuntu
release. If true this is not good enough and leaves a very bad taste.
The use of the scanner is for work not an intellectual exercise.
The printer problem is well known internationally and has occurred
before when changing from one Ubuntu to another. This was solved in the
past, the 'how to' publicised but has happened yet again. So much for
reports being noted.
As for Pan, this has been well discussed and details have already been
publicised. If you want more detail have a look at ubuntu-users list.
None of that was included in your original mail. Sorry if I was led to
believe that you had an unresolved problem. I was merely trying to direct
you to a support system that might help you resolve them.

Of course I would like to help.

Cheers,
Al.
norman
2007-05-21 12:44:49 UTC
Permalink
< snip >
Post by Alan Pope
Post by norman
Post by Alan Pope
http://answers.launchpad.net/ubuntu/ - If you are not already registered,
then click the link at the top right to register. Once registered come back
to that page and click "Ask a question" in the top left.
I am already registered have been a long time even before launchpad was
launched.
Post by Alan Pope
Post by norman
I am quite happy to do this if you can give a really good reason why I
should.
You sent a mail to a loco team list complaining that 3 things we broken with
your upgrade. Your mail was sent in reply to another mail, mid way through a
thread.
Clearly you misunderstood the purpose of my mail which was pertinent, in
my opinion, to the topic of how to interest windows users in the
advantages of Ubuntu. Perhaps I was not clear enough. My intention was
to make people aware that it is not enough to have a knowledge of the
good things about Ubuntu but to be prepared for the time when things do
not work out as you hoped.
Post by Alan Pope
The visibility by skilled people who can help you solve this issue is
therefore minimal. So the chances that someone might respond will be low.
However now we are talking about it I am sure someone will reply.
Again my point is missed. I am perfectly capable of contacting those who
can help. I just want ordinary, non-techie persons to be aware and, as I
said, beware.
Post by Alan Pope
The answer tracker I pointed you to is a support system on Launchpad. It is
part of the Ubuntu infrastructure. There are a number of people who
subscribe to the answer tracker and receive all the support requests that
come in. They spend their time answering exactly the kinds of questions you
posed.
Post by norman
Perhaps I should have added to the first paragraph in my
original post that I have been reporting bugs and making, what I hope
were useful comments, for more 2 1/2 years. I am not one to name drop
but, if you want a little more background, I suggest you look up Daniel
Silverstone who is my son.
I am not entirely sure what relavence that has to the issues you are having.
It has nothing to do with the issues I am having. Just to draw your
attention to the fact that I have, as a layman, a fairly lengthy
knowledge of Canonical and Ubuntu. My son worked for Canonical 2004 to
2006 and helped to develop Ubuntu, launchpad and other software you
probably use.
Post by Alan Pope
Post by norman
The problem with the scanner has been reported time and time again by
many users of different scanners. I believe the bug was known to the
developers even before 7.04 was released. I have been lead to understand
that the scanner problem may not be resolved before the next Ubuntu
release. If true this is not good enough and leaves a very bad taste.
The use of the scanner is for work not an intellectual exercise.
The printer problem is well known internationally and has occurred
before when changing from one Ubuntu to another. This was solved in the
past, the 'how to' publicised but has happened yet again. So much for
reports being noted.
As for Pan, this has been well discussed and details have already been
publicised. If you want more detail have a look at ubuntu-users list.
None of that was included in your original mail. Sorry if I was led to
believe that you had an unresolved problem. I was merely trying to direct
you to a support system that might help you resolve them.
I do understand and blame me if you like for not being more explicit. I
hope you now realise that my intention was not to ask for help but just
to arouse awareness.
Post by Alan Pope
Of course I would like to help.
Thanks for your offer and, for me, as well as for lots of Ubuntu users
around the world, the most helpful thing would be to make a whole
selection of scanners work. This would enable those who have not yet
been able to change to 7.04 because of this problem do so and also,
maybe, save those who have converted going back to 6.10.

Norman
Douglas Campbell
2007-05-21 13:34:12 UTC
Permalink
Dear all Ubuntu users

I am an otherwise happy user working on my PhD. I am trying to download
some packages for the R statistics program but come up with the
following messages:

trying URL
'http://www.sourcekeg.co.uk/cran/src/contrib/QCAGUI_1.2-7.tar.gz'
Content type 'application/x-tar' length 1017887 bytes
opened URL
==================================================
downloaded 994Kb

mkdir: cannot create directory `/usr/local/lib/R/site-library/00LOCK':
Permission denied
ERROR: failed to lock directory '/usr/local/lib/R/site-library' for
modifying

The downloaded packages are in
/tmp/RtmpJxvMD5/downloaded_packages
Warning messages:
1: installation of package 'QCAGUI' had non-zero exit status in:
install.packages()
2: cannot create HTML package index in:
tools:::unix.packages.html(.Library)

Does anyone have any suggestions, please about how I can unlock the
appropriate directory.

Many thanks

Douglas
Dave Walker
2007-05-21 13:54:04 UTC
Permalink
Post by Douglas Campbell
Dear all Ubuntu users
I am an otherwise happy user working on my PhD. I am trying to download
some packages for the R statistics program but come up with the
trying URL
'http://www.sourcekeg.co.uk/cran/src/contrib/QCAGUI_1.2-7.tar.gz'
Content type 'application/x-tar' length 1017887 bytes
opened URL
==================================================
downloaded 994Kb
Permission denied
You need to install with root access as a normal user doesn't have write
access to /usr/* . The easiest way to do this is probably from the
console. 'sudo' (superuser do) will give the application root access.

$ sudo tar xvzf QCAGUI_1.2-7.tar.gz
PASSWORD: <- Your current user password.


Or if this is part of an installation script:
$ sudo ./installme.sh


Kind Regards,
Dave Walker
-------------- next part --------------
A non-text attachment was scrubbed...
Name: not available
Type: application/pgp-signature
Size: 189 bytes
Desc: This is a digitally signed message part
Url : https://lists.ubuntu.com/archives/ubuntu-uk/attachments/20070521/7f823710/attachment.pgp
London School of Puppetry
2007-05-20 23:43:19 UTC
Permalink
Post by London School of Puppetry
I am always recommending it to friends but
Post by London School of Puppetry
they always look so alarmed at the thought of change and I 'm not very
good
Post by London School of Puppetry
at telling them why Ubuntu is so much better.- someone give me some
sales
Post by London School of Puppetry
talk quick!!!
Caroline (LSP)
Hi Caroline, Giving someone a good reason to change, when they're
happy with what they have is always hard !
I think its important to draw their attention to the negative aspects
of Windows. and contrasting them against the positive attributes of
Linux may work. Most people have never used anything other than
Windows. They assume that all computers are slow, need lots of
resources and get virus's (or is it viri!). Show them that there is a
choice... Like the bank advert says "There is another way.."
Q: Have you ever had a virus?
Did you know that some virus's/malware can steal your personal
details, turn your Windows computer into a gateway for pornographic
emails and get you into trouble? Ubuntu by the way isn't susceptible
to virus's like Windows is. Using Ubuntu can safeguard you from bad
people on the internet.
Q: Does your computer start up slowly? If not, you're guaranteed that
it will after time..
Did you know that Windows gets more and more 'bloated' the longer you
use it? This slows your Windows computer down, making it unresponsive
and sluggish. Ubuntu is designed differently. It doesn't get fat like
Windows ;-)
Q: Does it cost you a lot of money, every time you need a new program
to do something?
A standard version of Microsoft Office 2007 could cost you around 300
quid, Photoshop could cost you more. Did you know that Ubuntu has
thousands of programs available for free at the click of a button, and
you can still open all of your old Microsoft Office documents too!
In fact, this sounds like a reasonably good way to market Ubuntu via
leaflets etc!
Chris
Thanks Chris. I am saving your reply. Caroline
--
ubuntu-uk at lists.ubuntu.com
https://lists.ubuntu.com/mailman/listinfo/ubuntu-uk
https://wiki.kubuntu.org/UKTeam/
--
---
London School of Puppetry
www.londonschoolofpuppetry.com
-------------- next part --------------
An HTML attachment was scrubbed...
URL: https://lists.ubuntu.com/archives/ubuntu-uk/attachments/20070521/9ab24e61/attachment-0001.htm
Thomas Ibbotson
2007-05-21 08:08:51 UTC
Permalink
Post by Chris Rowson
Windows. They assume that all computers are slow, need lots of
resources and get virus's (or is it viri!). Show them that there is a
It's viruses, we don't speak Latin in this country, we speak English,
and to pluralise in English you add 's' or 'es'. Sorry to go off topic
there.

I use Ubuntu because I'm a student and can't afford windows, but also
I like to program and I like to fiddle with and tweak my computer. I'm
not a techie, but I do like to program and have had a couple of
programming summer jobs. There's no barrier in linux for tweaking, you
can do whatever you like, sometimes with disastrous consequences.
Ubuntu is so easy to reinstall though it doesn't worry me about
breaking it, but most of the time I can fix it without having to go
that far. I couldn't do the same with windows, my last computer didn't
even come with a windows CD, and anyway it's much more difficult to
mess about with windows.

I like the regular release system, I started on Dapper with a dual
boot system, and was excited when Edgy came out, and even more so when
Feisty came out, as it then became my sole operating system (that
choice was motivated by finance, I built a new computer and wasn't
prepared to pay for windows).

The only thing I miss is playing my old games, but I've got a nintendo
Wii console now, and I don't have much time to play games with doing a
PhD and seeing my girlfriend.

Tom
Peter Lewis
2007-05-21 10:15:34 UTC
Permalink
Post by Thomas Ibbotson
Post by Chris Rowson
Windows. They assume that all computers are slow, need lots of
resources and get virus's (or is it viri!). Show them that there is a
It's viruses, we don't speak Latin in this country, we speak English,
and to pluralise in English you add 's' or 'es'. Sorry to go off topic
there.
Oh, you mean like with Fungus, Cactus and Elvis?

;-)
norman
2007-05-21 10:49:45 UTC
Permalink
Post by Peter Lewis
Post by Thomas Ibbotson
Post by Chris Rowson
Windows. They assume that all computers are slow, need lots of
resources and get virus's (or is it viri!). Show them that there is a
It's viruses, we don't speak Latin in this country, we speak English,
and to pluralise in English you add 's' or 'es'. Sorry to go off topic
there.
Oh, you mean like with Fungus, Cactus and Elvis?
Please, don't forget narcissus and gladiolus.

Norman
Peter Lewis
2007-05-21 10:53:39 UTC
Permalink
Post by norman
Post by Peter Lewis
Post by Thomas Ibbotson
Post by Chris Rowson
Windows. They assume that all computers are slow, need lots of
resources and get virus's (or is it viri!). Show them that there is a
It's viruses, we don't speak Latin in this country, we speak English,
and to pluralise in English you add 's' or 'es'. Sorry to go off topic
there.
Oh, you mean like with Fungus, Cactus and Elvis?
Please, don't forget narcissus and gladiolus.
Sheep? Deer?

What about Linux?

Linuces? ;-)
Colin Humphrey
2007-05-16 18:49:51 UTC
Permalink
Hi all - I have a bit of trouble with PHP and Apache2, I have posted a
thread at:

http://ubuntuforums.org/showthread.php?p=2654531#post2654531

The thread is longish so I have not posted it here. If anyone is a LAMP
developer and has about five mins spare on a lunch break to take a look, I
would appreciate it alot.

Many thanks

Colin

_________________________________________________________________
The next generation of Hotmail is here! http://www.newhotmail.co.uk
Paul RJ Mellors
2007-05-16 20:28:38 UTC
Permalink
Post by Colin Humphrey
Hi all - I have a bit of trouble with PHP and Apache2, I have posted a
http://ubuntuforums.org/showthread.php?p=2654531#post2654531
The thread is longish so I have not posted it here. If anyone is a LAMP
developer and has about five mins spare on a lunch break to take a look, I
would appreciate it alot.
Many thanks
Colin
_________________________________________________________________
The next generation of Hotmail is here! http://www.newhotmail.co.uk
Hello Colin

I'm running a feisty lamp server, and to be honest, i installed it and
then used the LAMP option as part of the installation, well easy. It
install php apache mysql for me, all i did was set the root mysql password.

To set up virtual hosts i did it like this

http://www.paulmellors.net/index.php/2007/04/03/ubuntu-server-virtual-hosts/

Cheers
Paul
Colin Humphrey
2007-05-16 22:50:47 UTC
Permalink
Hi Paul

Thanks for the info I will be looking into it.

_________________________________________________________________
Could you be the guest MSN Movies presenter? Click Here to Audition
http://www.lightscameraaudition.co.uk
Continue reading on narkive:
Loading...